Speaker 1 00:00:11 Hello. Welcome to the roundhouse podcast with Paul Soro of Wichita state university, strategic communications. Thank you for listening today. We're gonna talk with Katie Zimerman. Katie is Wichita. State's new assistant volleyball coach. She agreed to return earlier this spring as a volunteer, she recently stepped up to one of the full-time spots. You may remember Katie Riley as a middle who played for the shockers from 2012 to 2015. She was on the 2012 suite 16 team. She played on three NCAA tournament teams, three Missouri valley conference championships. She earned honorable mention all American and all valley honors in 2015 since leaving Wichita state, she coached four seasons at Spartanburg Methodist, community college in South Carolina, the pioneers, right? Yes, they went 29 and 10 last fall. She started the beach program at Spartanburg Methodist in 2020. Katie also served as assistant coach at the university of Louisiana, and she played two seasons of beach volleyball as a graduate student at South Carolina. So Katie, what brought you back here to Wichita state?
Speaker 2 00:01:17 Yeah. Well, thanks for having me on I'm super excited to be back. Um, my husband parkers, Inman, he played baseball here. He got into residency for orthopedic surgery here. So he is what brought us back. And then I was fortunate enough to hop into the volleyball program
Speaker 1 00:01:34 And give us the complete family update. You have a son, correct? Family
Speaker 2 00:01:37 Update. Yes. We have an eight month old son named parks and yeah, he is wonderful.
Speaker 1 00:01:43 Okay. Uh, Parker, yes, catcher here at Wichita state fondly remembered. We just walked around the offices and Brent cabinets had to talk about how much he loved Parker, loves catchers, all that, all that kind of stuff. So shocker fans will remember you as a volleyball player. They will remember Parker as a, as a catcher. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, uh, you're in coaching as a profession. Take us back to the roots of that. How did you get into this job?
Speaker 2 00:02:05 That's a great question. Um, my graduate last semester, I was playing beach at South Carolina, you know, starting to apply for jobs in the real world. I got my master's in rehab sciences, exercise science. So I knew it had to be something specific, but I wasn't really sure what I wanted to do. Um, my sister played at the university of Louisiana under head coach, um, Heather za Spak, and she also recruited me. So they had an opening and, you know, originally it was kind of a joke to my sister saying, Hey, you should apply for this job, but then she was serious. And um, so we did it. We had a year off before our Parker start medical school anyways. And so I was fortunate enough to get the job and have really enjoyed, um, being in coaching ever since.
Speaker 1 00:02:52 So in 2019 was Chris Lamb's 20th year here. I contacted a bunch of former soccer VO, VO volleyball players to kinda get their memories of, of Chris lamb. Here's what you sent in. Hmm. And you said Lambo would also get in philosophical discussions and I loved it. We would talk about Jesus and the earth and the players on our team. In our end of the season meetings. When I ask him questions, he would always say, Katie Riley, one day when you're in my seat, you'll understand and you'll have to make these decisions. And I would laugh and say, Lambo, I will never be in your seat. Mm-hmm <affirmative> but here I am a head volleyball coach and I have a different volleyball perspective because, because of him. So what, what did Chris lamb see all those years ago that told him you were, you were fit for coaching?
Speaker 2 00:03:34 That's a great question. I would love to ask him that. I think he also would just say things in that meaning of, you're gonna have to make hard decisions, whatever you go into, but it just made me laugh cuz I did not think I was going to go into coaching. I just loved playing volleyball. Didn't really know what I wanted to do. But um, yeah. I love making relationships with, you know, young women who need help taking that next step, whether it's in volleyball or life and just being there for them. And then, you know, my job is to coach volleyball and that's really fun too. So I don't know what he saw, but I'm thankful that he said it and just kind of made me chuckle, um, because Lambo says a lot of great things. And so that meant a lot to me.
Speaker 1 00:04:18 Was there a moment when you got hooked on coaching, when you began to think, all right, this is, I've made the right decision. This is what I want to do.
Speaker 2 00:04:26 I think after a little bit of time doing it, if you think, well, what else would I do? Um, sometimes people say, you know, do you love work? All those things and work is still work, but I don't think I don't wanna do anything else. And you make memories with people, you get to be a part of so many people's lives. And I think that's really important. Um, and I grow a lot from that too. So I don't know if there was a certain moment, but more so I don't wanna do anything else. And you do, I'm impacted by a lot of people and then you get to impact others, which I think is super important to do in life.
Speaker 1 00:05:00 So you're obviously very early in your time, Wichita state as a, as a coach. H how do you imagine it will be different working for, with alongside Chris lamb as opposed to playing for Chris lamb?
Speaker 2 00:05:15 It will be different for sure. I think, um, I do have a, a leg up, um, compared to someone else because I've played for him and, you know, people change and sayings change different things like that, but being able to adapt, we have a great relationship even when I was playing for him and, um, understanding a little bit of what he expects, you know, this is a very high level program, um, how he runs certain things. I think I'll be able to help mediate a little bit of how he explains things maybe. Um, but I also have, I've grown a lot in the last few years, too in coaching. And so being able to bring another perspective, um, I'm excited for that. I think I am the first player, obviously that has, uh, now been on staff with him. So I think there are some GA's, but, um, so it'll be a first for sure, but I'm really excited for the opportunity. I think obviously it'll be a large transition, but, um, cuz Sean and Chelsea are amazing. Um, but I'm really excited.
Speaker 1 00:06:22 What is the advantage of having played here? Having gone to school here, you can talk to recruits about that. You can talk to current players about your experience. What, what's the advantage of being an assistant coach who has that kind of background in this program?
Speaker 2 00:06:35 Well, I hope it shows that I, I loved it, you know, and it was a great, a great time. I think one of the reasons I am also in coaching is just, I had a great experience and I know some people don't and so I wanna make sure that other people have an awesome experience, just like I did. Um, a lot of people poured into my life in, you know, different departments on campus, um, and just people in Wichita. And so I think that speaks volumes that we're back here and this is not where either of us are from, and we still have people who make it feel like a home. Um, when we found out we were moving back here, you know, we realized, wow, there are so many people still who are there that we know who care about us. Um, and I think that's important for recruits to know too that there's a lot of people who are very involved, um, in soccer, volleyball, and I think that's something special.
Speaker 1 00:07:27 So you've been an assistant coach. You've been a head coach. Describe your coaching philosophy. What have you arrived at?
Speaker 2 00:07:34 I think I'm still figuring it out. Um, I think if you were to ask my players, they would say just like as, as a player, I am very energetic, very loud, very positive. Um, and yeah, I want to give them all the confidence that they can, you know, learn the game on their from us, but then like be able to do it on their own. I think that's something special that Lambo really teaches volleyball. Um, and I think when you graduate from here, you know, volleyball very differently than a lot of other programs because he teaches and is able to figure things out in a different way than just like the basics. And so, um, I hope that I've grown from learning from him and how to, you know, do that at different levels. Um, and so I think just being a positive light for people and bringing people alongside each other to obviously win a common goal, but everyone has a different part to play. And so really making sure everyone's like based off of that one goal.
Speaker 1 00:08:45 Okay. You said how Chris teaches volleyball differently, which I think is a really important point about soccer, volleyball that yeah. Even after all I've watched over the past, whatever 15 years now, I still struggle to describe to people describe it. What's different about Wichita state volleyball.
Speaker 2 00:09:03 Um, he creates plans, game plans, everybody's Scouts, you know, the team that they're going to play, but I think his is just another level. Um, we create different defenses just for one player rather than, you know, a, a full team or a season. Um, I know that the American conference is very different than Missouri valley. So those are different things too. But when I was here, you know, you might be playing two or three different defenses in one night, just based off of the attacker. And so I think just, uh, challenging players to grow and be able to do multiple different things and expect that of people like you have to understand what's going on in the game and it is like a chess match that can change. Um, and I think a other programs that maybe don't get that same training, um, they couldn't go out and coach and think of different creative ways to maybe beat a team. But I'm, I'm, I'm betting that a lot of his players could go and beat great coaches, but just because they understand the game.
Speaker 1 00:10:11 So I went to the Spartanburg website, your team went 29 and 10. Uh, so they did kind of a season wrap up mm-hmm <affirmative> and you submitted a quote, you know, kind of summon up the season. And it was, uh, you know, how proud you were, the team improved, had a great season. And then you started talking about, they all the team also needs to improve their time management. They need to be better communicators, those kind of things. And they need to do it with a smile on their face. And I thought that was, that was very interesting. It tells me, uh, you're, you're serious about that part of being a coach. Describe that kind of, I guess the off the floor kind of influence you, you hope to have on people.
Speaker 2 00:10:51 I think volleyball ends at some point, you know, unless it becomes your career like it has for me, um, people go on and, you know, will need to get jobs, have families like live the rest of their life. And there's so many things people talk about in sport that you learn, um, and grow from. And so being diligent and, and giving everything you have in all of the areas of life, I think translates to the court. But I mean, this is an opportunity that other people don't get. And so being grateful for that and doing, doing it well, I think is important. Um, because some people don't have that opportunity and it sets you up for success later in life. So I think just why would you not have a good time doing it? Why would you not be positive and grateful? Nobody wants to be around people who are, you know, energy suckers. And so I think I just try and relay that. And once people get on board, you know, usually it's a better environment and that creates a lot of positives, not just on the court.
Speaker 1 00:11:54 So people love keeping coaching hires in the family. And I think fans will be excited. They will remember Katie Riley. They will remember the good times. They will be thrilled to have a former shocker back. I also think there's a lot of value in going other places learning, you know, here's a new twist, here's a new technique. Here's how it happens at other schools. What's an example of maybe something you've picked up at the other places that, you know, you think is important to carry forward. That may be helpful here.
Speaker 2 00:12:21 That's a great question. I think, um, well the first thing that jumps out is I went and played beach for a few years and I being a middle here, uh, didn't pass much my last few years, you know, and beach is a game that you have to do everything. And so I think just learning about multiple skills, I think sometimes at the highest level, people just do one thing and they might not realize like what settlers need to do, or they might not realize like the emphasis serve receive has on them. Um, and I think just maybe understanding a little bit more about the full game. One allows you to appreciate other people and, um, you give them a little more grace, but then, you know, you can understand how you could help them better just like things at work, the dynamic of your position. Um, so I think that's one thing, but at Louisiana we did like a lot of scout team stuff. I think that that's important. Um, when I was here, we did that, but it was based off of like defenses on one person where we really, uh, try to mimic the other team. And I think that that's important depending on, on the conference, but yeah, there's, there's a lot of things. I think a lot of it is player relations and I'm excited to, to be involved in that.
Speaker 1 00:13:39 So you go from a head coach to an assistant, I'm sure that will change a lot. Give, give us a little bit of insight. How does the routine maybe start to change your job responsibilities, start to change from Spartanburg to Wichita state?
Speaker 2 00:13:53 Well, coming from a junior college, I think that's just a, there's a lot more that goes into it. Um, I did everything, you know, from travel to fundraising to, you know, putting the lineup in. But
Speaker 1 00:14:05 Yeah, I didn't even look, did you have an assistant coach?
Speaker 2 00:14:07 I had some volunteers volunteer assistant, which they were wonderful. Um, but they had other jobs, you know, so they weren't there all the time. But I think something I've learned is that, you know, my goal is to, is to assist Lambo. Obviously that sounds self-explanatory, but like that might change in different seasons of what, what he wants or what he expects. And so to make his job easier in whatever aspect that is, um, that's, you know, what my job is to do, I am really excited to learn also. I think sometimes when you're I was being the head coach, I learned by error, um, which is necessary sometimes, but I'm excited to just, you know, hear other opinions and learn and be kind of a team rather than just solo in my brain. Um, but I think I'm, I'm great at backing people up. Uh, I think that was just that's one of my strengths in life is just encouraging others and, um, kind of being what, what they need from me. So I'm not worried at all about being the assistant at all to Lambo. Um, but yeah, I'm excited to learn a lot and kind of see what my role will be depending on who the other person is as well.
Speaker 1 00:15:27 So you, you learn you're coming back to Wichita state what's, uh, the first steps you take to begin getting familiar with, you know, the roster, the, whatever you feel like you need to be familiar with. How did, how have you started preparing over the recent weeks?
Speaker 2 00:15:42 I've mostly been reaching out to players on the team, um, to just trying to start to get, to meet the girls that are here and just get to know them better. Um, luckily I've been able to spend a good amount of time with Chelsea and she, you know, loves this program, loves these girls. And so that's been great to hear from her, um, just the normal routine and things that worked really well. Maybe things that we could improve a little bit. And so just kind of spending time getting to know people I think is really important for just jumping into this is how it could be, or this is how it is. Um, so that's probably my main focus. The next couple weeks, a lot of girls will be here for camps in July. So looking forward to getting to know people before we start in August,
Speaker 1 00:16:28 Recruiting will be a big, big part of the job. Give us a little insight. What are you looking for when you walk into a gym and there's prospects there? Do you have, yeah. How do you start to think about that, that process of evaluating, uh, volleyball players
Speaker 2 00:16:44 For sure? Well, the beginning is my eye has gonna have to change a little bit from what I was looking at. Um, but I think, you know, Lambos been doing this a long time and he knows what he wants. I think I will play a good role in maybe the non volleyball part. Obviously you can see when a kid is good, you know, they have a great arm swing, they're scoring well, they lead, but kind of the other things of how they treat their teammates. And do you think they would be a good culture kid? And honestly, the things that, um, aren't directly on the scoreboard, but they, they really affect it. Um, so looking forward to that, honestly, I love energy. Obviously people probably know that. And so my eye goes to people who, you know, lift up their teammates and are like just loving the game of volleyball because this fun, I know that sometimes people get it, they think it's a job and you know, they go to practice every day and it can get mundane, but I mean, it's awesome. And the fact that people wanna do this and people are supporting them. And so just someone who's enjoying their time out there building people up, um, and obviously, you know, scoring points, but a competitor
Speaker 1 00:17:57 Scoring points is important. Yes. So how often over the last four or five years, did you find yourself mimicking Chris lamb giving a Chris lamb kind of speech or using Chris lamb kind of phrases or jokes or analogies?
Speaker 2 00:18:14 I don't know that I can ever, uh, match his analogies. So I don't know that I would say that I did that often, but, um, I do think that I relied a lot on what we did here to think outside the box, if something wasn't working. So I would say that was probably the biggest part of, you know, if something in our, in our lineup, wasn't working, figuring out ways that, you know, we could just switch up numbers. Um, he's a big statistics person. And so this last season, I, I called him asking about some differences between a 5, 1 62, like how to, you know, just navigate where you can really see the difference in points. Um, and so just having conversations like that, I think, you know, came from my time here, but just being okay with not doing something, how everybody else does it, I think is huge. And other people are like, oh, wow, that actually worked like, yeah, you just have to try it. And if it scores it scores. So I would say that that's my, that was my biggest thing. I don't think the analogies will I'll have to work on those to be like him, but I don't think they'll come
Speaker 1 00:19:21 More San Francisco giants, baseball references. Those.
Speaker 2 00:19:24 Yeah. I, I could start with that.
Speaker 1 00:19:25 Yeah. Okay. So you talked about the, his willingness to experiment, which I guess is one thing that really differentiates this program. When you talk to other volleyball coaches or they always seem to, or Wichita state players always bring that up. That is just part of the deal that you may come to practice and you may be, you know, a different position, different role. We're gonna try this. Is that something that is somewhat unique about Wichita state volleyball, that you're going to try all these different things and, and see what works?
Speaker 2 00:19:55 I, I mean, I think so. Yes. I haven't been obviously a part of a lot of different programs, but just the ones that I have been, um, that was one of the reasons I came to Wichita state. My recruiting COO coordinator at club was like, you'll fit right in because I was kind of that person that could do a few things. I was never the top, the top kid. I was on a great club team. Um, but you know, I was a pin here for the first two years. Wasn't outside attempted to play all the way around for a little bit. And then our stud middles left or graduated, he was like, Katie Riley, you're gonna get hit slides. So then I transitioned to middle, you know, and I don't know if at other programs they would've done that. I don't know if they would've just said, you're gonna battle it out in the position that you are.
Speaker 2 00:20:44 I'm not really sure, but I think that that's an advantage that he doesn't just see things one way. He could see individuals in different roles and you don't have to stick with it because people do go up and down or against one team, someone might score, you know, better off of one footer. You know, it just depends given the team that you're facing, but I think it is an advantage that you don't have to do the same thing over and over cuz he's, I mean, I think he said in insanity, that's not his quote, but I feel like he says it a lot that is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. So, um, yeah, I think it's important.
Speaker 1 00:21:21 Do you have a favorite Chris lamb drill that you used?
Speaker 2 00:21:27 Um, I don't have, I love the EMS warmup drill that was named after Emily Stockman because of her last two steps, just because it was fun. And I was like, oh, I get to touch the ball all the time. Um, but there's so many and he, and that's another thing he just creates new drills. If he wants to work on something specific, he just creates it, you know, for that specific instance. So I think that players appreciate the fact that they're not doing the same thing their entire four years. Sometimes he sticks with something for, you know, a season of time, but you're always learning. You're always trying something new. And I think that people grow because of that. And just in life, the fact that you have to adapt, you might be working with different people or your classic. I mean, anything like something as simple as you're running a different defense in a time, that's really important for you to score, um, is important that you're like, okay, I could do that. And it's not a problem. And I think that translates later in life,
Speaker 1 00:22:28 Man versus wild seems to be the most popular answer. When I ask that kind of question. Did you ever use man versus wild?
Speaker 2 00:22:34 Your, they say that as their favorite troll?
Speaker 1 00:22:36 Yes. Well, or maybe not famous most memorable most, yes.
Speaker 2 00:22:39 Most, yes. Yes. That is a fun drill. Uh, we actually, cuz RJ Abella was here. Um, he was my first assistant when I was here. I was chest state and then I played for him at South Carolina, which was awesome, but he redid that drill to fit in the beach game, which I think was really cool. Um, as a middle, it was not my favorite drill cuz you just run a lot, but it is fun for the person who's trying to get the points on the other side, cuz it's emphasized towards you. Um, but we have the machine that like spits balls out at you. And so I think if you were to come into the gym, you would know that it's that drill cuz it's intent. It's fast, it's fun looking at it. Um, but there's a lot of moving parts
Speaker 1 00:23:25 And it's a catchy name. So it's, it's easy to remember.
Speaker 2 00:23:28 Yes, yes.
Speaker 1 00:23:29 You were here very successful era of soccer, volleyball, top memories. What Springs to mind when you think about your time out on the, out on the court here?
Speaker 2 00:23:40 Well even being back, seeing some former teammates, it was just like, we just had fun and I know that everyone's experience is different, but I'm really close with the girls that were in my class. Um, I'm in a couple of their weddings this year and just the time that we spent together, um, obviously the volleyball portion, like freshman year, we went to the sweet 16 just cuz that hadn't been done before. That was really awesome. Um, my senior year playing at Nebraska, uh, that was really fun. We had done that I think in the spring, but played really well. And they went on to win the national tournament, um, playing, oh my senior year. We also went to Hawaii. That was fabulous when they did that every four years and we play, we won two of those three games. Um, so that was great. And just being able to do something that wasn't in our usual routine, like I think we were there for a week, just fun, things like that. Um, I talked to Jody Larson the other day and we were talking about, we did the talent show here that should probably never be brought up, but just things that were like, we just did life together. And I really enjoyed that part and obviously being successful on the ball on the volleyball court, um, I think was based off of some of those relationships,
Speaker 1 00:25:00 You'll be in a position I guess, to do this kind of thing. What advice would you give to freshman Katie Riley if you had that, had that ability
Speaker 2 00:25:09 Go to every indie, which I think I did, but that's because the older girls said get in the gym as much as possible.
Speaker 1 00:25:16 Explain an indie for
Speaker 2 00:25:17 An ind for those who don't, it's just an individual when you have some extra time to work on skills, um, cuz you just get to, it's just your group and the coaches. So you get to work on what you want. Obviously they have a say, but it's different than practice where it's a full team. Um, and you just really can get gain some strides. I think my senior year was completely changed because I did this one drill that I literally hit a red cone dummy as like that was a blocker. And so I just swung, like I was tooling it for the, just trying to score. I was working on scoring. Um, but I did that a lot and I think that completely changed my senior year scoring. So just that would be one thing I think, um, from a volleyball standpoint, taking statistics for any of our girls, I'm gonna encourage them like Lambo love stats and they're important like stats show you who won.
Speaker 2 00:26:16 And so I think it's very important to learn and understand, but not be consumed by it, uh, easier said than done. But at the end of the day, like if you get the win, then you know, you might not have hit very well, but like you could have contributed in other ways and that's huge. And so just reminding it's a nice balance. Um, so I wanna make sure that I bring the balance aspect of competing of the win loss column. Um, because there's a lot of other things like we make our whole day about volleyball because that's my job, but this is only part of their day. And so kind of trying to balance that out, um, I think is really important, especially freshman year coming in. Um, and just, you're kind of thrown in August. It's double days, you know, you're, everything is volleyball and then, oh, you're supposed to be good at school. We're traveling, there's a lot going on. You're meeting all new people, you're away from home. And so I think just encouraging them that it'll be okay and it'll be great. And just like give it your all every day. I know that sounds cheesy, but some people don't and over time that adds up.
Speaker 1 00:27:22 Do you have a favorite book, movie TV series? You're you've been binging that you will recommend to, to, to us.
Speaker 2 00:27:30 Oh, like just for fun,
Speaker 1 00:27:32 Just for fun. Or if there's a book you're you've had your team read anything like that, that pops to mind that we can, we can leave people with, with something to do after this podcast
Speaker 2 00:27:42 In club. One time we read the power of positivity sounds cheesy because people would be like, oh, she's so cheesy and positive, but it just kind of showed you some, some stats that like things work, you know, there's science to stuff. I really enjoy that. Um, even like thinking there talked about like high fives, I've said that a lot recently like touch, uh, relayed to more points and I'm like all about that. So making people high five, you know, the simple things, but I think that was in that book. Um,
Speaker 1 00:28:12 That's a very Steve Nash thing, NBA point guard. Yeah. Love the high fives and I love
Speaker 2 00:28:18 The high fives. Yeah. So, but yeah, that's what comes to my mind.
Speaker 1 00:28:21 How about TV, movies, anything like that, that you would recommend?
Speaker 2 00:28:24 Well, just did the top gun thing. You know, we watch the first one need to go watch the second. Um, my favorite TV shows are the office in new girl. I can't do intensity. I just wanna relax and like laugh a little bit. Um, my eight month old, I don't watch a lot of TV cuz if I try and sit down, then I'm up again. But those are things about me.
Speaker 1 00:28:46 Was this the first time you had seen top gun?
Speaker 2 00:28:48 Sadly? Yes.
Speaker 1 00:28:49 And what did you think to admit I've gotten differing opinions about how well it's held up from 1986 to now. What did you think?
Speaker 2 00:28:58 Um, I heard the second one. People loved it. Like they thought it was better. So I mean, it was, it was good. I don't know when people say the, like the famous phrases. I don't like, for example, we finished it actually last night. It had to take a couple nights cuz I'll fall asleep. Um, but I said it's almost over. Like I didn't realize that was the end. So it was good. But maybe I should, I don't know. Talk with more like real gungho top gun people. Are you a fan?
Speaker 1 00:29:31 We watched it again a week or so ago and I had seen it, you know, originally when it came out and my second impression was that it was a lot of really memorable set pieces. Mm-hmm <affirmative> or whatever, you know, everybody remembers the you've lost that loving feeling. Everybody remembers the volleyball scene, the volleyball scene. Yeah. Everybody remembers, uh, you know, all these different goose, dying, all the, I hope I didn't spoil that for anybody who hasn't hasn't seen it. So those were all interesting and memorable. But as far as a complete coherent movie, I'm not sure it was great. It was fine, but I'm not sure it was great. That was kind of my, that was my,
Speaker 2 00:30:08 You might get some feedback now on it. Yeah. <laugh> yeah.
Speaker 1 00:30:11 All right. Well Katie, welcome back to Wichita. Welcome back to Wichita state. We appreciate your time. Thank
Speaker 2 00:30:16 You so much.
Speaker 3 00:30:30 Hi, this is Rick Neuma president of Wichita state university. Check out the latest episode of the forward together podcasts. Each episode, I sit down with different guests from shocker nation to celebrate the vision and mission of Wichita state university. Listen, wherever you get your podcast.
Speaker 1 00:30:58 Thank you for listening to the roundhouse podcast, courtesy of Wichita state university's strategic communications. We appreciate your time. We encourage you to rate reviews, subscribe wherever you get your podcasts such as on iTunes or Google play. You can find more roundhouse
[email protected]. Thank you for listening
Speaker 4 00:31:19 And they let him pass it up court. And then he gets picked off along three by Pango. No good. One second. It's over. It is over and Wichita state has beaten the number one team in the nation to go to the sweet 16. Go crazy with Utah. I know you are.
